Conversation
Jarkko Sakkinen
jarkko
Edited 1 month ago
Tried Podman Desktop by Red Hat as it was first monitor I found.
It's IMHO fucking horrible. Looks bad and a complete mess, which is pretty relevant attribute for that purpose. I mean the use and purpose is to visualize the situation, right?
This feels much more sane GUI option: https://github.com/marhkb/pods
#podman
It's IMHO fucking horrible. Looks bad and a complete mess, which is pretty relevant attribute for that purpose. I mean the use and purpose is to visualize the situation, right?
This feels much more sane GUI option: https://github.com/marhkb/pods
#podman
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Neal Gompa (ニール・ゴンパ) 
Conan_Kudo@fosstodon.org
@jarkko If Podman Desktop had been built as a Qt application, it probably would have looked a lot more like Pods and still achieved its cross-platform goal.
Unfortunately, it's a Electron app. Because Enterprise Software ™️.
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Jarkko Sakkinen
jarkko
@Conan_Kudo Yeah, it was like stereotypical enterprise GUI :-) Would make sense if it was CISCO Podman Desktop... The very first question you get ask is query to enable Telemetry...
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@Conan_Kudo I hope some smart person some day does Electron runtime based on Servo. It could make it sleeker given how well-constructed GPU pipeline it has.
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@Conan_Kudo This was just a shock for me because it did not match my typical RH expectations. It's exactly like someone had made a fake RH application that is actually ransomware 😅
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@Conan_Kudo RH brand for me is like GPL across board, polished desktop experience, standards compliance and generally top notch quality. Shitty Electron app with Telemetry red flags straight from the get go does not fit.
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Alexander Sosedkin 
monk@social.unboiled.info
@jarkko @Conan_Kudo or maybe, just maybe, we stop calling webpages "apps" and start building apps instead. not swap out engines in cars based on perceived sleekery when all we actually needed from said cars is a portable music player.
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@monk @Conan_Kudo That is sort of different discussion, and I'd say "it depends" :-)
Podman Desktop is not just Electro app, it's a shitty app even if you compare it to apps made with Electron.
For a modern GPU the main glitch with web technology based apps is not that much the UI description language. It's more related to the software rendering pipeline from the 90s duct taped into composition based pipeline, and single core design duct taped into multi-core.
The difference between app and "non-app" is not really whether the app uses Gtk, QT or HTML. It's really the level of access to the local system resources. At least this is the conclusion you mostly likely end up with, if you start to specify more formally the difference between "an app" and "a web page".
I said this in some other thread too but Electron run-time on top of Servo could be pretty nice even for hardware with relatively slow CPU but still multi-core, and mediocre GPU. Servo is a software architecture that has been optimized with an eye for modern GPU's and multi-core CPU's as the primary targets.
Gtk and Qt only perform better because they have had a privilege to break backwards compatibility with the new major versions, not because they would do something magically awesome to get the rank of being a "native app", or their engineers would particularly be better in their job.
Podman Desktop is not just Electro app, it's a shitty app even if you compare it to apps made with Electron.
For a modern GPU the main glitch with web technology based apps is not that much the UI description language. It's more related to the software rendering pipeline from the 90s duct taped into composition based pipeline, and single core design duct taped into multi-core.
The difference between app and "non-app" is not really whether the app uses Gtk, QT or HTML. It's really the level of access to the local system resources. At least this is the conclusion you mostly likely end up with, if you start to specify more formally the difference between "an app" and "a web page".
I said this in some other thread too but Electron run-time on top of Servo could be pretty nice even for hardware with relatively slow CPU but still multi-core, and mediocre GPU. Servo is a software architecture that has been optimized with an eye for modern GPU's and multi-core CPU's as the primary targets.
Gtk and Qt only perform better because they have had a privilege to break backwards compatibility with the new major versions, not because they would do something magically awesome to get the rank of being a "native app", or their engineers would particularly be better in their job.
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Neal Gompa (ニール・ゴンパ)
Conan_Kudo@fosstodon.org
@jarkko @monk Well, there's also another aspect of GTK and Qt compared to Electron: they are not restricted on how the rendering and presentation layers should even work. Ultimately, Electron is using the web stack, which means you are constrained to HTML, CSS, and JavaScript. That does limit what you can change, because everything has to remain compatible with web standards.
This is key because native toolkits are able to optimize further for their use-case than Electron can.
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Jarkko Sakkinen
jarkko
@Conan_Kudo @monk I did cut some corners yes, but having a size-fit pipeline for data always does also a major difference :-)
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@Conan_Kudo @monk apologies for red hatters, i love fedora so much overall, thus this caught my "what **** is this shit o_O" antennas :-) if RH would overall suck you could not see the difference...
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